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the-problem-your-business-solves

Finding The Real Problem Your Business Solves

Marketing Podcast with John Jantsch

john-jantschIn this episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast, I’m doing part two of a three-part series talking about my new book launching Sept. 21, 2021 — The Ultimate Marketing Engine: Five Steps to Ridiculously Consistent Growth. I’m diving into step two – finding the real problem your business solves.

Key Takeaway:

People don’t buy the products or services because they want them, they buy them because believe they will solve a problem. As discussed in part one of this three-part series, the Ultimate Marketing Engine is a successful customer. How do you help your customer become successful? First, you need to understand what problem it is they’re trying to solve and how your product or service can be the solution.

In this step, we’ll explore how businesses that understand, communicate, and promise to solve the real problems their ideal customers face, can make a giant leap towards rendering all competition irrelevant.

Topics I cover:

  • [1:14] Where to listen to step one – mapping out where your best customers want to go
  • [2:42] Why one wants what we sell
  • [4:30] Humans do things because they desire something or lack something – our job is to connect those desires to a solution
  • [6:07] What reading Google Reviews can tell you about a business
  • [7:43] How to figure out the problem you’re trying to solve
  • [9:10] The right way to interview your best customers

Like this show? Click on over and give us a review on iTunes, please!

This episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network.

 

mapping-where-your-best-customers-want-to-go

Mapping Out Where Your Best Customers Want To Go

Marketing Podcast with John Jantsch

john-jantschIn this episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast, I’m doing part one of a three-part series talking about my new book launching Sept. 21, 2021 — The Ultimate Marketing Engine: Five Steps to Ridiculously Consistent Growth. I’m diving into step one – taking your customers where they want to go.

Key Takeaway:

Your business succeeds when your customer succeeds. The Ultimate Marketing Engine is a successful customer. In the book, I introduce the idea of viewing your customers as members – and this isn’t like a Costco membership. The goal of serving a customer as a member is to help every member get the transformation they are seeking, not the product you are selling. In this episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast, I’m talking about step one of the five steps to ridiculously consistent growth – mapping where your best customers are today and where they want to go.

Topics I cover:

  • [1:53] The Ultimate Marketing Engine is a successful customer
  • [3:33] Step one – Mapping out where your best customers are today and where they want to go
  • [4:11] Why you should start shifting your mindset to view your customers as members
  • [5:03] Creating your Customer Success Track
  • [6:10] Generating a list of milestones and creating a guaranteed roadmap
  • [9:38] The benefits of taking on this mindset of making your customers successful
  • [11:08] Why the Customer Success Track is really the overarching strategy for scaling your business

 

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John Jantsch (00:00): Hey, is it duct tape marketing listener? We know you're always on the lookout for ways to more efficiently scale your business. That's why I'm so excited to chat about. I digress another show on the HubSpot podcast network. Troy Sandra is the host of I digress, talks all about how you can eliminate complexity, complications and confusion from your business equation and create clarity to streamline strategy solutions that achieve scalable and sustainable success. Check out episode 24, start there 14 minutes or so. Strategy is power. You know, I love that idea. So listen, learn and grow with I digress on the HubSpot podcast network at hubspot.com/podcast network.

John Jantsch (00:57): Hello, and welcome to another episode of the duct tape marketing podcast. This is John Jantsch I'm going to do a solo show today. In fact, I'm going to do a series of a couple of solo shows this week. If you're listening in order because it's launch week for my new book, the ultimate marketing engine five steps to ridiculously consistent growth. So I'm going to cover in short order, those five steps over a series of podcast episodes. Hopefully you can string them all together. We'll have them in the show notes, all strung together. If you want to pick up a copy of the book, if you haven't yet, it's just the ultimate marketing engine.com. You can find lots of free resources there and speaking or resources. The book is chock full of every exercise and checklist and task lists that I give you so that you can get the work done.

John Jantsch (01:43): That's in the book. I'm going to start today by reading, actually from the book to give you a little sense of the content, but also to set up today's lesson. So what is the ultimate marketing engine? I'm guessing you're reading this book or listen to me read this book because you have at least a mild interest in the answer to that question. So I won't hold back. The ultimate marketing engine is a successful customer. Now you may be saying, duh, everyone knows that you need customers after all. That's pretty much what every marketing book says a customer's king, blah, blah, but I'm going to show you how most, every other marketing book, including a couple I've written gets this idea terribly wrong. The school of thought that says the purpose of a business is to profitably, acquire and retain customers is not entirely wrong. It's just limiting and hard to sustain the purpose of a business.

John Jantsch (02:39): What if the purpose of a business was to discover what it takes to make your customer successful? What if then you concentrated all of your efforts on that goal for an ever expanding roster of ideal clients. What if growth came with your customers? Not from them. Note that my answer to this question is the ultimate marketing engine includes not just the word customer, but successful customer successful may seem like a nice adjective thrown into flower up the writing, but it is much more than that. Think about what it takes to help a customer succeed. And the key distinction comes to life. Your business succeeds. When your customer succeeds, I'm going to stop reading there and really dive into the first step, the steps in order. Then I'm going to talk about step one map where your best customers are today and where they want to go as well.

John Jantsch (03:39): We're going to talk about today. Step two, uncover the real problem you solve for your ideal customers to transformation. They are seeking. We'll do that one in another episode, step three, narrow your focus to the top 20% of your ideal customers. Step four, attract more ideal customers with the narrative. They are already telling themselves and step five, which is essentially all about referrals, scale with your customers by serving their entire eco system. So step number one map where your best customers are today and where they want to go in this book. I introduce the ideas customer as members. Now I'm not necessarily talking about fact, I'm not talking about a membership program or something like Costco. Those are great business models. I'm really talking more about a point of view. What if we came to look at our customers more like members, what if we attracted members to our organization, people who actually wanted to become customers to invest in themselves because of what we were able to offer them.

John Jantsch (04:44): Now that may sound like an interesting idea, and I try to bring it to a very practical life using something that I call the customer success, track the idea behind the customer success track is to actually just create a roadmap of where your customers are today and where they want to go. Now, this roadmap is going to have several elements. The first element is just a list of stages. What I find is that most of our customers, and maybe you find this to be true for your business as well. Most of our customers come to us in a certain stage of their business. We sell basically marketing consulting and strategy. And so a lot of people come to us lacking that strategy. And of course lacking the implementation of the online presence that it really takes to have a strategy come to life. So they're in a foundational stage.

John Jantsch (05:39): Now what we've learned over the years is that people that come to us in that stage have certain characteristics. We can recognize them. We can spot what's going on in their business. And because of that, we also know the challenges that they are probably facing on a daily basis. They're not able to generate enough leads or certainly able to convert leads. They're not able to attract ideal clients. These are all symptoms or challenges of being in that stage because our job is to solve those challenges. We've also been able to create a list of milestones. We know what we have to accomplish. We know the boxes we have to check in order to move people to that next stage. And so we can ask a series of yes or no questions, not is their website effective. No way to answer that question, but we can say, does the website load effectively on a mobile device?

John Jantsch (06:35): Because it needs to, we can say yes or no. If the answer is yes, great check that box. If the answer is no, we can now assign tasks to accomplishing that milestone. So it effectively gives us almost a guaranteed roadmap that we could complete all of the milestones on for them in that stage on our customer success track. We know the promise of what's going to happen now. So in other words, when we build somebody's foundation, now we can effectively generate and affordably generate leads for them. So that's the promise that be in the next stage. And let's hear a word from our sponsor. HubSpot CRM platform is easy to adopt and there are really two reasons. Two features that make this possible, that contact timeline and the mobile app and mobile keyboard HubSpot's contact timeline gives you the historical context. You need to get the work done and connect with customers because all of your customer data is in one place.

John Jantsch (07:32): It can serve as a single source of truth. In HubSpot, you can take an action, right from the contact timeline, make a call and roll a contact in the sequence, schedule a meeting. You've got it. And if you're on the go, you just use the mobile app to make it all happen and keep everything up to date. You don't even have to spend a lot of time training your team. You can be sure that all the contact information is going into one system, making your team more efficient, look better adoption with a CRM leads to better data, richer insights, and a bigger impact on your customer experience. Learn more about how you can scale your company without scaling [email protected] So we map out we, we, our customer success track for marketing for our customers has five stages. And we're able to map out increasing activities, increasing milestones that are really going to mature.

John Jantsch (08:26): We know for a fact are going to mature their marketing. So that's the idea behind this customer success track that we are able to document exactly what we need to do to move people to the next stage. Now, when you get the co the ultimate marketing engine and you find the companion course, that's contained and referenced many times in the book, you're going to find a whole series of forms and checklists. In fact, I've documented our complete success and all of the milestones for each state. So you're going to have the roadmap for marketing. If you want to use this for marketing your own business. But my real goal is to get you to think this way for your business, for your customers. I don't care what industry you're in or who you serve. I believe that this idea is an idea that will advance your business and ultimately allow you to scale your business, your existing, ideal profitable customers, rather than just out there floundering around looking for more of the same or more of anybody who seems to have a need for what it is that you sell.

John Jantsch (09:29): And that's why I say the ultimate Mar marketing engine is a successful customer. You're going to focus on making that customer successful. Now here's some of the side benefits. If you will, of taking this point of view or this mindset for us, it's actually changed our mission for our business. Our mission now is pretty simple. Take our customers from where they are today or where they come to us today, to where we believe that they want to ultimately go. That becomes our mission, but it also becomes a tremendous sales and marketing message. Because now when we are having a conversation with a potential customer, we're not just talking about here's how we're going to fix today's problem. We're actually saying here's where we're going. Here's the entire roadmap. And by the way, here's the promise. That's going to be available to your business if we accomplish these stages, if we can move you to that next stage.

John Jantsch (10:21): So it's a very powerful and potent sales message and great differentiator. But what we've also found is that let's face it creating systems, something I talk about probably you're tired of me talking about and write about constantly. This forces us to really document our success, track the way we are going to deliver the results we promise on in a way that allows us to hire differently, to train differently, to delegate work. We're actually able to get many of the tasks accomplished in a routine manner without adding overhead, necessarily to our business, because they are repeatable tasks that we do over and over again. So this is not this idea of a customer success track is not simply something that we do as a marketing strategy. It's become really the overarching strategy for the business in every aspect of really scaling our business. And I'm excited to bring you a little more detail on the other steps in this work, but if I've piqued your interest today, head on over to the ultimate marketing engine.com, you can download some free chapters.

John Jantsch (11:33): There's actually a free course that you can get, which is going to be some videos. And you can sample some of the worksheets to all of this before you really buy the book. Obviously the, the book, when you're listening, by the time you're listening to this, the book is available, uh, to ship from your favorite bookseller. And when you get the book you are going to find it is, or at least the companion, a website that we reveal in the book is going to be all the resources that we use on a daily basis. Working with our clients, really implementing the ultimate marketing engine in their businesses. So appreciate you tuning in. Hopefully you can string these together and have a complete end to end journey through the five steps to ridiculously consistent growth until next time take care. All right, that wraps up another episode of the duct tape marketing podcast.

John Jantsch (12:25): I want to thank you so much for tuning in, feel free to share this show, feel free to give us reviews. You know, we love those things. Also, did you know that we had created training, marketing training for your team? If you've got employees, if you've got a staff member that wants to learn a marketing system, how to install that marketing system in your business, check it out. It's called the certified marketing manager program from duct tape marketing. You can find it at duct tape, marketing.com and just scroll down a little and find that tab that says training for your team.

Speaker 2 (13:07): [inaudible].

This episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network.

 

the-ultimate-marketing-engine

Building The Ultimate Marketing Engine

Marketing Podcast with John Jantsch and Douglas Burdett

john-jantschIn this episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast, we’re doing things a little differently. Douglas Burdett takes on the role of guest host and interviews me about my new book launching Sept. 21, 2021 — The Ultimate Marketing Engine: Five Steps to Ridiculously Consistent Growth. Douglas is the host of the Marketing Book Podcast where each week he interviews authors of best-selling marketing and sales books.

Key Takeaway:

What is the Ultimate Marketing Engine? It is a successful customer. Almost every other marketing book (including a couple I’ve written) gets this idea terribly wrong. 

My new book The Ultimate Marketing Engine details the evolution of my thinking around marketing over the last ten years and contains nothing but real-world ideas gathered from working with business owners and consultants every single day.

And in the book, I take you on a marketing journey. But we won’t travel the same old road you have been down before. Rather, I plan to push you to think about marketing from an entirely new point of view that allows you to create ridiculously consistent growth.

In this episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast, Douglas Burdett takes on the role of guest host and digs into concepts from my new book starting with how this book is different from the many marketing books out there, viewing customers as members, moving away from the traditional marketing funnel, creating a customer success track, and so much more.

Questions Douglas Burdett asks John Jantsch:

  • [5:41] Can you talk about the resources and the course and any other bonuses folks get along with The Ultimate Marketing Engine?
  • [10:46] What new ground does The Ultimate Marketing Engine cover that makes it different from the other 350 other books that have been featured on the Marketing Book Podcast, for instance?
  • [13:07] Let’s unpack one of the biggest concepts from the book which is this idea of viewing customers as members — and full disclosure this isn’t like a Costco membership or software as a service.
  • [15:54] How does the marketing hourglass concept help a company to think differently than the traditional marketing funnel?
  • [19:39] What is a customer success track, what could a company do to begin one, and can you sketch out what that customer success track would look like?
  • [25:55] What does the top 20% actually mean? And is the issue that companies just want more customers or do they not think through who the top 20% of their customers are?
  • [30:59] You cover referrals really heavily in the book. Can you talk about the importance of referrals having a referral system? And can you also tie that in with yet another new idea from your book about helping your customers build a whole ecosystem?
  • [37:15] Explain what you mean when you say: “People don’t actually want what we’re selling.”
  • [39:27] So towards the very end of the book, the very first line is: Is your website is the hub of your marketing engine? If it’s that important, why is it in chapter nine out of 10?
  • [40:46] Tell people where they can get access to all of the resources from the book and the course.

More About The Ultimate Marketing Engine:

More About Douglas Burdett:

More About The Duct Tape Marketing Consultant Network:

Like this show? Click on over and give us a review on iTunes, please!

John Jantsch (00:00): Hey, duct tape marketing listener? We know you're always on the lookout for ways to more efficiently scale your business. That's why I'm so excited to chat about. I digress another show on the HubSpot podcast network. Troy Sandra is the host of, I digress, talks all about how you can eliminate complexity, complications and confusion from your business equation and create clarity to streamline strategy solutions that achieve scalable and sustainable success. Check out episode 24, start there 14 minutes or so strategy is power. You know, I love that idea. So listen, learn and grow with I digress on the HubSpot podcast network at hubspot.com/podcast network.

Douglas Burdett (00:56): Hello, and welcome to another episode of the duct tape marketing podcast. My name is Douglas Burdett, and I'm very honored to be guest hosting for John Jantsch on this episode, like you I'm Melissa in to the duct tape marketing podcast. I'm also the host of the marketing book podcast, where each week I interview authors of best-selling marketing and sales books. And today I'm going to be doing that as I interview the author of a book that I have read and strongly recommend. The book is the ultimate marketing engine five steps to ridiculously consistent growth. And the author is a gentleman who is no stranger to this show. His name is John Jantz. Now I'm going to introduce John Jans properly because he never does it for himself. He's just that kind of Midwestern guy doesn't want to talk about himself, but here we go. John Jantz is a marketing consultant, speaker, podcaster, and author.

Douglas Burdett (01:45): His other books include duct tape marketing, the referral engine, the commitment engine, duct tape, selling SEO for growth and the self-reliant entrepreneur. He's also the founder of the duct tape marketing consultant network, which trains and licenses, independent consultants and agencies to use the duct tape methodology. John's small business advice has been featured in the New York times. The wall street journal Forbes, fast company, entrepreneur, CNBC, CNN money. And of course the duct tape marketing podcast you're listening to right now, Seth Goden called John Janse, the Peter Drucker of small business tactics and interesting facts. John is the father of four daughters. He's one of 10 children and he is a diehard Kansas city, Royals baseball fan, John, congratulations on the ultimate marketing engine and welcome to your own long running show. The duct tape marketing podcast.

John Jantsch (02:46): Well, I'm just, I'm glad we recorded this Douglas because I'm just going to play it every show I'm just going to let you introduce me. I must admit it's a bit surreal being on the theoretical other side of the mic, but we've done this before. This is actually the second time we've done a desperate,

Douglas Burdett (03:03): I had the honor of interviewing you and Phil Singleton about SEO for growth and a hi, just love that book. And I, I can't remember how that happened, but I remember thinking, aren't you going to talk on your own show about this? And maybe you were just a little surprised or delighted at how excited I was about that book. And I, I S I had read an article you'd written about guests hosting other shows, and I said, Hey, look what this chance guy said, what do you think? You said, okay, uncle I'm in, I'm in, I'll do it.

John Jantsch (03:33): I think listeners, of course, hopefully you've found, Douglas's show the marketing book podcast because I get interviewed by a lot of people. And he really is one of the best interviewers in, in large part because he actually reads the books, which really helps. But if you haven't checked out the marketing book podcast, you really should. If you're interested in books at all, make sure that you're listening to the marketing book podcast.

Douglas Burdett (03:57): Well, thank you. And I should also say that what I didn't add to John's bio, but which is now going to be pretty much featured is that he is now a member of a very exclusive club called the marketing book podcast five timers club. So what that means is that, you know, he can just pull up to any taco bell in the United States. And just tell him that you don't tell him he's John. Janse just say, I'm a member of the marketing book podcast, five timers club. There's only three of us and, and John, you're just going to see what things are gonna start happening for it. I'm just going to leave it at that.

John Jantsch (04:29): Wow. I can't wait to can't wait until I, you know, closing the bars down at 2:00 AM again, so, and, uh, and heading over to

Douglas Burdett (04:37): That's right. I'm sure. I'm sure. So you're a big, uh, Kansas city Royals fan. I'm just wondering, have they started doing the John Jans bobblehead day at coffin stadium?

John Jantsch (04:47): That would be awesome, but I don't think it would attract very many fans, which is really the whole point of, of, of the bobble heads. And you know, that frankly they've, they are probably looking for some new promotions because fortunately the product on the field isn't is it performing so well?

Douglas Burdett (05:04): Well, yeah, maybe, I don't know. I just don't think you should under value, you know, the presence of your own audience, you know, you could get podcasters from around the world. There may be show up at Kansas city, you know, it could be John Jans day. Let's just, let's just test it one time. Okay. Let's leave it at that. All right. So now this it's more than just the book. This also has really great downloadable resources, which I've already shared with one of my colleagues and also for people who buy the book, there's actually a course that goes with the book. This is [email protected] Talk, talk about the, the resources and the course, and I guess any other bonuses for,

John Jantsch (05:46): Yeah, well, you know, one of the things Doug, when I wrote my first book in 2007, there weren't a whole lot of books out there. I mean, people were hungry for sort of new information on the digital age of marketing, but in the 15 years that have passed since then there are books everywhere. I mean, it's gotten so much easier affordable to self-publish their distribution channels. So they're there in the time we've been talking probably five or 600 bucks came online. So I think like so many things, you know, the expectation is that it has to be not only great content. It has to maybe include some innovative ideas, but people have to be able to take action on it. That's the real differentiator. I think this book is, is, is largely a strategy book, but I kind of refer to it as a strategy book with a workshop tucked inside of it.

John Jantsch (06:38): And you know, at the end of every chapter, I give you action steps and, and I ultimately want people to take action. And so I've tried to make it as easy as possible. You mentioned the companion course, which is really videos of me explaining some of the core concepts and introducing some of the resources that you will encounter. And that that course has actually been available, you know, was available a couple of months prior to the launch of the book because I wanted people to taste it. I wanted people to see a little bit of what they were going to get when the book became available. But when readers do actually buy the book, they'll be able to return to the website. There's a URL printed in the book. I don't know, several dozen times that I caught it, that I want to send people to, because I really do want them to take action on this. This is not just theory that I've come up with and wrote about and hope works. I mean, this is stuff we do every day and teach every day. And so I've created a whole tool set so that people can benefit really from that as, as a reader of the book. I think that ultimately the impact I'm going to have is that people do something. I don't want them to just buy the book and read it. I want them to do something.

Douglas Burdett (07:46): Yes. I could envision this book being seen on a lot of desks open. In other words, people would be referring back to it because all the exercises you have there, as well as the online ones, this is really something that you and your team could work through, whether you're a marketer or a business owner, uh, don't try and do it all at once though.

John Jantsch (08:04): It's a, it's a system. I mean, that's a great, great advice. In fact, I would tell people, I'd let people off the hook even more than that, get one or two good ideas and implement them. And I guarantee you, you will have gotten your 1699 worth or whatever it is that you pay for the book. So, so, so really, you know, I don't want people to read the book and go, oh, this is a lot of work to do all this, do one thing and then come back next week and do another thing.

Douglas Burdett (08:28): Yes. Great advice. Great advice. Cause this topic marketing, all this sort of thing can be, it's really overwhelming for a lot of people. And what's funny is in the book you give examples and it's based on some examples you've had in your own business, providing marketing services. And you talk in fact about how overwhelmed business owners are, as it relates to marketing. It's not something they started out to do is become a marketer. They do something else. So that's a very relevant. So let me just read two quick excerpts from the beginning and then get into some of the key highlights of the book during most of 2020 and into 2021. You saw article after article proclaim, the strategies needed to market during a pandemic. Most of them boil down to some version of stop taking your customers for granted and stop spamming people. When has that ever not been good advice, good marketing that delivers value to those who are trying to solve a problem is always in season.

Douglas Burdett (09:30): And it always arrives from the customer's point of view. Don't misunderstand. This is not about the customer always being right. This is about being relevant in a customer's life about changing the context of how they view your business or industry. It's about making every other business irrelevant in their eyes. In this book, I'm going to ask you to rethink how you view your current or future customer, how you view marketing and how you choose who you work with. Ultimately, you will get the chance to dump most, everything you have been told about how to build your business. You will see that there is an entirely fresh perspective available, steeped, not in what you see everyone else doing, but in what is in your heart, what serves your grand purpose and what creates the greatest value for those, you choose to call customers and then skipping over to page three in this book, I'm going to take you on a marketing journey, but we won't travel the same old road you've been down before. Rather I plan to push you to think about marketing from an entirely new point of view that allows you to create ridiculously consistent growth. So John, let's talk about that. What, what new ground does the ultimate marketing engine cover that makes it different from, well, maybe the other 350 other books that have been featured on the marketing book podcast, for instance?

John Jantsch (11:01): Well, I think there's a couple of things that I challenged people to do that go against conventional wisdom. I mean, there's so many Facebook groups and courses that you can buy today that talk about funnels and funnel hacking. I really at least spend a lot of ink on trying to talk about how, why that idea is so incomplete and then a complete customer journey is something that we have to be thinking. And frankly, I think it's become more important than ever. I think nobody knows how to do anything anymore. You know, all, all systems are broken. We now have the opportunity to really fix everything. But I also think that there, there was, there, there was a real desire for a return to some humanity in business again. And, and I think that, that, you know, you know, people talk about being customer centric. Well, we all learned what that actually meant, uh, the last year. And, and I think is what it's going to mean going forward. It's no longer a buzz word. I basically make it, or at least make a case for looking at it as the entire strategy and mission of a business. So that's certainly one part. The other part that's going to really challenge a lot of people's thinking I'm not the first person to say this, but it certainly, I certainly get a lot of pushback when I do say it and I'm, oh, that means you're

Douglas Burdett (12:11): Making progress.

John Jantsch (12:13): That's right. And I'm going to suggest that people focus on the top 20% of their customers and not necessarily, you know, reject everyone else, but, uh, see that top 20% is the real opportunity, uh, for growth and maybe ultimately the place that you take your entire business. And that's the one part that scares people probably the most. And I talk about, you know, not only the rationale for it, but how to do it and why to do it. And I think that, you know, hopefully the, those two elements, the idea of a complete customer journey that include this thing that I call the customer success track, which really can become, I think that the goal and the mission for, for an entire business is, is to take a customer from where they are today, to where they want to be, as opposed to sell them what it is we have to sell them. And that all starts really with this idea of focusing on the right customer.

Douglas Burdett (13:05): Well, let's talk some more about those. Let's, let's unpack one of the biggest concepts from the book. I thought that I had, I had never had this sort of paradigm before, which is this idea of customers as members and full disclosure. We're not talking about like a Costco or a membership or a software as a service, but this, this idea of treating customers like they are members.

John Jantsch (13:34): Yeah. And I'm glad you made that distinction because obviously the word member does have some baggage, but it was, to me it was the best word, but I mean, it, in the sense of thinking about an organization that you want to become a member of an organization,

Douglas Burdett (13:47): Emotional memberships at the subconscious level, that they don't, you might not even use that.

John Jantsch (13:53): Yeah. Yeah. I mean, and I'm not suggesting people start referring to their customers as members. It's really more of a point of view that that to understand why somebody joins an organization or cause even that they want to be a member of it's because they, they, you know, they really want to, uh, invest in themselves in their businesses rather than just make a purchase. They want to find an organization that they're not just going to refer, but they will evangelize because that organization is, is so bent on creating transformation in their life or in their business. And so I start that as, as really the, the beginning point of changing how you come to think about your customer. Now it's a great idea. Sounds great. You know, makes good speech a bullet, you know, in, in when I'm giving talks, but I've also tried to make it very practical and give you how I think this is, can be accomplished and really how it can actually become an practical way to build your business.

Douglas Burdett (14:55): Yes. It reminded me of, or it brought to mind the idea of customers who innately feel like you're looking out for their best interests rather than just trying to churn and burn or sell and, and, and, and, and ignore them like, like most businesses seem to.

John Jantsch (15:11): Yeah. And I actually start the book out with a story of a customer that, that what I saw and experienced with them really shown a very bright light on how important that is. I mean, there are a lot of businesses out there that actually have just innately done that. And we saw a lot of them actually not only survive, but really thrive through the pandemic because that element was such a driving force in why people stayed with them and bought gift cards from, from them, even though they couldn't use them, you know, at the time those kinds of things I think really showed kind of who was that kind of business and who wasn't that kind of business. And to me, what I tried to say is can't we all be that,

Douglas Burdett (15:52): Yeah, let's do that practical point. Let's talk about how the marketing hour glass helps a company to, to think that way. In other words, let's contrast it with, you know, the typical sales and marketing funnel of what are, you know, pick your, pick your words, awareness, consideration decision. I've also seen the hourglass concept portrayed in a couple of books as a bow tie. In other words, it gets narrow and then it gets wide again. But I think too many companies have half a Botox.

John Jantsch (16:23): Yeah. Well, it's it, you know, even the words you used, awareness, consideration decision. I mean the, the typical marketing and sales funnel is all about what we want them to do, what we want our prospects and customers to do. And what I suggest is that that marketing day is become less about creating demand and more about organizing behavior. So my marketing journey to marketing hourglass consists of seven stages. And I like to, I like to suggest that these are behaviors that people want to do, and we just have to organize them, doing them

Douglas Burdett (16:57): Just to interrupt you say that way too many companies have maybe just two steps rather than seven.

John Jantsch (17:03): Yeah. I mean, the typical marketing that I encounter is here's our ad to come on down and buy that. Those are two of the stages I have to know about you, but in between that, no, I have to develop some fondness for, or at least a decision to maybe go a little deeper. I have to develop trust. Maybe I have to actually find a way to try what it might be like to work with your business. And certainly when I do buy, I want that experience to stay just as high because the buyer's remorse is a real thing. It's, it's going to kick in. So what are you doing to intentionally make sure that that stays high now beyond that, once I become a customer, what's your process for retention for repeat sales, for maybe finding out what else I might need. And then obviously the ultimate goal to lead every single one of our customers become an evangelist or a referral source for our business.

John Jantsch (17:54): So those stages of know, like trust, try, buy, repeat, and refer to me, really map out the entire journey that pretty much everybody wants to go on with the businesses that they do business with. And our job really is just to allow them to, to facilitate it, to make it a great experience, to make them, you know, so thrilled that they want to go out of their way to tell their friends, neighbors, and colleagues about us. And, and that, you know, that journey, I think portrays a much better picture of what we have to do as marketers.

Douglas Burdett (18:26): Yes. It's interesting. When you say that buyers want to do that again, back to the use of the word, subconscious, even at the subconscious level, people want that. That's why like your sales process is often viewed as a preview or a try to see if, is that a preview of what it's going to be like to be a customer. And often it is basically if it's a bad

John Jantsch (18:48): Sales process. I mean, I think it's very true. We don't sit there and go, okay, I'm going to call these people and try them, or I'm going to fill out a form on their website and try them exactly. That's what we're doing.

Douglas Burdett (19:00): Oh yeah. Oh yeah, absolutely

John Jantsch (19:02): Absolutely. Had a bad if we have a bad experience, there may at the trials over.

Douglas Burdett (19:08): So one of the other things from the book that was, um, I thought very different having read several hundreds of these was not just the customer's member concept, but you talk about the customer success track. And I want to ask you about that. And as I was reading through the beginning of that section, another book came to mind, which was Joey Coleman's book, never lose a customer again. And then I turned the page and you mentioned his book. So there's two books at least that talk about this, this concept, but talk about a customer success track, and maybe what, what a company could be doing to start to

John Jantsch (19:45): That's one out. Sure. So the reality is, so the customer success track is, is really my attempt to say, how can we take our customers from where they are today to where they want to go? But the reality is it's something that I've maybe subconsciously created over the years because I want to keep a customer forever. I don't want to do marketing projects. I want to have a client or a customer that stays with me and I mature and grow their marketing because the reality is once we do a good job with marketing, they're going to need something else. And then they're going to get to a certain level and they're going to maybe need us to help them build a team internally, for example. So,

Douglas Burdett (20:20): And they might even give you a referral, which we're going

John Jantsch (20:22): To talk about. And so really developing this customer success track was really came about as my approach to how can we mature and grow with our clients because most of our clients seem to be coming to us at a certain stage. They have certain characteristics of where their marketing is and certainly challenges because they can't get past that stage. And so we started finding ourselves, you know, creating a repeatable system to take from that first stage, which was typically foundational building out of things to the next stage, which was our ability to start generating leads for them because now they had the foundation. And so us driving traffic to a webpage or a landing page was going to make sense. And then we went to work on, okay, let's how can we, how can we ramp up the leads while we also ramp up the conversion of those leads? Because that's really the goal and that we found that it kind of had a linear fashion to it. And so we actually developed it can be

Douglas Burdett (21:16): The mistake to try and do those latter things before the first things are

John Jantsch (21:20): Squared away. Yeah. I mean, we, we see it all the time, people running ads to their homepage and, and, um, you know, because they don't know any better. And so, so what we found is that we could create a, uh, a list of milestones for each stage that, that we can answer yes or no to, and, and assigned task, you know, have they done this? Have they done this and really almost get through that checklist. It was almost guaranteed that they were now ready to go to that next stage. And so in an attempt to keep these clients for a long time, we just kept growing those stages and doing more and adding more. And ultimately what, what we discovered is that this became really our entire mission. So instead of inviting clients in so that we could fix the thing that was bothering them today, we actually, we actually educate.

John Jantsch (22:09): And, and certainly in our sales messaging, talk about the entire roadmap, talk about what future state is going to look like and talk about, you know, kind of how and why we're going to get there. And, and what it automatically did is had people looking at us as a long-term solution. But it also, as I said, it really, it became our mission. It certainly became, you know, how we thought about product and service development, how, who we hire and how we train. I mean, it really, this roadmap, you know, really becomes and has become the entire strategy for our business. And so I document this thoroughly in the book. So if you're interested in marketing and what a marketing roadmap looks like, including tasks and milestones, it's in the book and it's in the additional resources. But my real goal is that I would like to see how many other businesses that are not marketing businesses could take this idea and apply it. Because I think that it is universally applicable. Obviously there are some industries or some types of businesses where, you know, it'll immediately make sense, but I think if you stretch your imagination a little, it doesn't really matter what business you're in. You can take this approach of growing with your clients and making that kind of the, the, their success, you know, ultimately your primary goals.

Douglas Burdett (23:25): Yes. And as I was reading through the book, probably even before you mentioned it, I think I thought, man, this is so much better for sales too, because it helps to bring the future to the present and helps people understand all the complexity of whatever it is, whether it's marketing services, an accounting firm or building a house, and it helps them to heal, helps you to manage expectations better,

John Jantsch (23:54): You know? And it actually, it actually allows us to attract an ideal client as well, because we know if somebody comes to us and says, oh, that's all great. Yeah, well, we'll get to that, but just, I want to run some Facebook ads. Yes. They're not going to be a good fit for us. And so consequently, this approach is not really going to appeal to them, but it is going to appeal to somebody who realizes that marketing is an investment that you're never done. That it's not an event that it's, it's a system in your business. That takes a long-term approach. I mean, that's who this will appeal to. And ultimately that's who we're trying to attract. And now let's hear a word from our sponsor. HubSpot CRM platform is easy to adopt and there are really two reasons. Two features that make this possible, the contact timeline and the mobile app and mobile keyboard HubSpot's contact timeline gives you the historical context.

John Jantsch (24:47): You need to get the work done to connect with customers because all of your customer data is in one place. It can serve as a single source of truth. In HubSpot, you can take an action, right from the contact timeline, make a call and roll a contact in a sequence, schedule a meeting. You've got it. And if you're on the go, you just use the mobile app to make it all happen and keep everything up to date. You don't have to spend a lot of time training your team. You can be sure that all the contact information is going into one system, making your team more efficient, look better adoption with a CRM leads to better data, richer insights, and a bigger impact on your customer experience. Learn more about how you can scale your company without scaling [email protected]

Douglas Burdett (25:35): Yeah, just it's so true. It's, it's, it's almost ingenious because it helps to ward off the people that aren't a good fit who if you do try to work with them, they're not going to be happy. You will not have helped them become successful. And they're going to say bad things about you because it was not a good fit in the first place with that in mind, let's go back to that 20%. You mentioned, can you say a little bit more about that in terms of, is it, is it is the issue that companies just want more customers or do they not think through about who their top 20% of their customers are? And you should also explain what top 20% actually means. It doesn't necessarily mean just revenues.

John Jantsch (26:18): Yeah. I think the real issue is we're afraid to say no, it's hard to say no. I mean, of course we're in the chase. In fact, for a lot of people, the chase and somebody saying, well, could you do this for me? That's actually the most exciting part for a lot of people in, in business. I still suffer from it, you know, today, no matter how much I preach this stuff, we, we got an inquiry for a, sort of a one-off kind of service from a company that is located in a country that we really don't have any presence or true knowledge of how their, their business culture works. And I still had this inkling of saying, well, if they'll pay enough, but you know, and that's, I know better. Right. But you know, we, we ultimately turned it down because what we don't realize, because this isn't put in our face, you know, the, the offer for a couple thousand dollars or whatever it is, is real, it's tangible.

John Jantsch (27:10): We know what that is, but we don't see as the opportunity loss that is happening because we chase those things. It is very difficult for somebody to realize that you are the absolute choice and I'm willing to pay a premium for you to do the work for me. When you are talking about the 27 things that you could do for somebody the, this 80 20 rule, which is kind of cliche, but boy, it sure shows up in a real way, still around. It must be working. And, and, you know, I've seen it when I can stand back and have the, the emotional detachment to look at somebody else's client base. You know, I can, I can show them that that 80% of their profit is probably coming from their top 20% of their clients. And yet probably 50 50 time-wise is, is being dedicated. And what I mean by that is that that bottom 30 or 20% also, there's sort of this inverse math, you know, suck up a lot of time as well somehow.

John Jantsch (28:07): And, and so, you know, if we, if we could get to the point where we really understood who we offer the most value to, who's the most profitable who really has the right problem with the right situation or the right behavior or value set that, that, that will work with, you know, our way of working. I think that we can, we can do a couple things. We can narrow our focus messaging wise to talk about their approach, their problem, who they are, you know, how we solve their problem in an effort to attract more people like them. You know, the customer success track we talked about has a little bit of when that becomes a sales tool has a little bit of attracting the right clients, but it also allows us to then start saying, okay, what, what can we do that would really blow them away?

John Jantsch (28:55): How could we make this even better? What we're doing, because now we're so focused on, instead of trying to serve people that are, we're having to create new stuff for, we're really focused on creating stuff just for these group, the 80 20 applies also to, you know, 20% of your top clients would pay you 10 times more probably, uh, if you could discover a way to serve them doing it. And some even smaller percentage of that group would, would maybe pay you a hundred times more, if you could figure out how to actually provide that service or provide that value to them. And, you know, anybody who's been in business any amount of time at all knows, it is so much easier to actually discover what somebody who already trusts you with someone who has already given you money and gotten value for it. It's so much easier to sell more effectively to those folks than it is to go out and find more people, you know, to give you the a hundred dollars starter price or whatever it is.

John Jantsch (29:54): I, you know, I've seen it happen time and time again, in, in my business, you know, I had a workshop that I did for, uh, 20 people, 20 businesses, and it was a very low cost kind of beta, you know, kind of thing. And at the end I just said, Hey, I got room to work with three of you, a one-on-one coaching doing X, you know, for X amount of money. And I had six people, you know, that wanted to do it. And it was, I'm doing quick math. It was 30 times more expensive than what they had paid to be there in, in that, you know, day long workshop. Um, and I just, I'm, I'm only using that example because we all have that. We just don't think to ask, we just sell our $49 product all day long to more people. And we don't realize that there are people that, that have bought that, that would now give us $4,900. If we, if, if we focused on what, you know, their pain points were or what they needed next.

Douglas Burdett (30:49): Yeah. I think a lot of companies don't realize that their customers like them more than they realize, and they, and they're ready to buy more. Let's jump to the, the part that you cover really heavily at the end of the book about referrals. And I should remind listeners that you've written an entire book about referrals and why that is so important. And of course it ties in with the thing I already mentioned about the top 20%. So can you talk about the importance of referrals having a referral system? And also, can you tie that in with this idea of yet another new idea from the book about helping your customers a whole?

John Jantsch (31:32): Yeah, so, so my thought on this is that if you do these first four steps, so, so what we're talking about is step number five in the process, the, the referrals or a focus on referrals is actually just the, almost the only outcome that can occur. So if you think about it, we create this customer success track that, that, that really focuses on transformation. So you're going to work with the right people. They're going to be thrilled. You're going to make them successful. That's that's step number one to getting referrals. Anyway, now we're going to narrow our focus to the top 20%, our most profitable customers who are already referring business to us. So we're now going to attract more of the same, and those folks are going to refer more of the same because they've had a great experience, obviously steps three and four, go into a lot of what it takes to attract and message and all the channels that we have to play in today. And then we ultimately end on step five being, you know, impacting your client's entire ecosystem. So that step is, is really, if you know, there are probably five or six total processes for how to make generation and an automated system inside of your business

Douglas Burdett (32:43): And explain what you mean by ecosystem.

John Jantsch (32:45): Well, so one of the things that that I've done for many years is that, you know, I believe that everybody that we work with, obviously this is, I guess it works for B to C too, but, but certainly works in B2B. If I'm working with somebody, another business owner, they have other service professionals that help them with their accounting lawyers, bankers, you know, things of that nature because I provide marketing. And so one of the things that, that we have done as a bit of a habit over the years is that we will develop a marketing plan for a client, for example, or a branding strategy or whatever people want to refer to it as. And we typically will offer to, to meet with and engage the other professionals that serve them as a way to educate them on kind of here's the thinking, here's what marketing's going to do.

John Jantsch (33:33): Here's the strategy and the, in the marketing for this client. And, and the, the point of doing that is to provide more value for our client, because I believe if I teach their accountant, what we're going to be doing in marketing, that the accountant will actually be more prepared to serve that client or understand where expenses or expenditures are going to be, you know, budget. And I think that that actually benefits our client, but, but it actually allows us to do a better job to, I sometimes find things well, here's why this is going on, or here's this, you know, expense that they're going to have to do. So that's why they can't invest in. So, I mean, it's a, it's a great learning experience for me as well. But over the years of doing that, in addition to helping our mutual client, it is almost always created referral relationships because all of a sudden that accountants go, wow, nobody else has ever done that with any of the other clients that I've worked with. And that was really useful. And so in almost all cases, we've served our client and in doing that set up another referral relationship, and we could do this dozens of times with some clients.

Douglas Burdett (34:36): And one of the things in that section of the book that I found very interesting or was a great reminder, was sort of activating your marketing through all your employees. I mean, how many times have I worked with a client where, you know, it's like, yeah, just leave it at the loading dock. You know, there's not a lot of buy-in and we work hard to overcome that now, but it's you realize just how important it is. And it also reminded me of this notion that the average employee has 10 times as social media reach as the company does. So well, let me just ask,

John Jantsch (35:08): I, I was just gonna say it and I mean, it doesn't have to be a, we're going to give out prizes and do all the, you know, I mean, part of what gets buy in is, I mean, how often does the marketing department sit around and co create the new campaign and the new strategy, whatever nobody else in the company even knows what's going on. I know they haven't

Douglas Burdett (35:24): Even taken that step.

John Jantsch (35:26): And so it means some of us just hate teach this stuff, you know, because any way, shape and form of which your CA your, your company comes into contact with a prospect or a customer, that person, or that interaction is performing a marketing function. So let's make sure we're all on the same page,

Douglas Burdett (35:41): A really important point that you made in your book. I think it's, I have difficulty thinking of companies, particularly medium to small size ones, where there are not many employees who don't have some impact on the customer, even if it's a, a baggage handler. That's very much customer facing, even though they're not actually talking to the customer.

John Jantsch (36:05): Yeah. I mean, I'll go step goofier than that. You know, how many times, I mean, how many times I worked with, so maybe you have to, I'll put it that way, you know, with companies where we're doing a great job, I love the people were doing prior to our valley value. That's, you know, it's awesome. We love it. We've got a great partnership. And then we send an invoice and then we get like, the, the lawyers from, you know, were

Douglas Burdett (36:28): Sending us

John Jantsch (36:30): Back all these information about all these forms we have to fill out and all these things, you know, it's like, maybe they need those things. Maybe they don't, but you know, they're performing a marketing function. I mean, they, they are impacting the relationship that, that we have with that organization. And is it the same brand promise that, that marketing and everybody else is delivering on?

Douglas Burdett (36:50): Yeah. Yeah. Well, let me just ask two other big questions about the book, and then we'll go, and now this is a little bit longer than most of your episodes, but doc gosh, darn it. It's 200 pages and we're not being, we're just skimming the surface. One of the, my favorite chapters, probably my favorite chapter was chapter six. The real problem you saw really got into psychology and just a beautiful way. Explain what you mean when you say that people don't actually want what we're selling, what that's going to hurt a lot of feelings.

John Jantsch (37:26): I mean, I love, I love to just I'll be doing from the stage. You know, I'll throw up this slide, no one wants what we sell and what their problems solved. And we don't, I mean, that sounds so counterintuitive. Of course they want what we sell because it does this and it has this. And, and ultimately, you know, I, the example I love to use is me. You know, I sell marketing strategy, nobody ever, ever, ever wakes up and says, I'm going to go get some marketing strategy today. I really want that. But they do say, how come every time somebody calls, they want a lower price, or why? When I look at Google or my competitors are ahead of me, those are the problems they want solved. And they just happened to be solved by a better marketing strategy. And so, so once we can articulate that we get you, we understand the problems you're having.

John Jantsch (38:10): They'll listen to us and allow us to connect that to the solution. If I just went out there and started saying, everybody needs marketing strategy, come on down and get it. There's not going to be much. There's not going to be much uptake in that. But if I start talking about, you know, the reasons or, or the ways in which you can become the, the, you know, the price leader and, you know, be the most profitable company in your industry that starts talking about things that they want. And now I can connect that to really, you know, how they get it done. And I, and I think in some cases, frankly, a lot of our prospects and customers, best customers, don't, don't ultimately know what their problem is. And so in many cases, by being the company that says, here's why you're feeling that here's why that's happening, you know, is, does that resonate? You know, you, you can really build a significant amount of trust and differentiate yourself because everybody else is talking about how long they've been in business. Yeah.

Douglas Burdett (39:07): Yes. So the last question is 10 chapters and an epilogue in the book chapter nine. So towards the very end of the book, the very first line is your website is the hub of your marketing engine, John Jantz, if it's that important, why is it in chapter nine out of 10?

John Jantsch (39:27): Well, I think I said this on your podcast. Well, as well, Douglas, the two star reviews that will show up in Amazon will say that same question, but about what, what I want to, what I

Douglas Burdett (39:39): Will not have read the book, but they'll complain. Yeah.

John Jantsch (39:41): But, but, um, what I go on to say from that is that everything else leading up to this is going to make your website now an effective hub of your business. We started with, you need a website and it needs to do this, but we hadn't thought about the customer success. Chuck, we haven't thought about how we're going to narrow our focus. We hadn't figured out the problem that we can promise to solve. Then we're just going to build another website that doesn't do much. And so that's why I really leave all of the channels to generate leads and convert leads really late in, in the book for that very reason. And again, I know not everybody is that approach is not going to appeal to everybody, but people who want to invest in their business for the longterm will get that. We need to do that much strategy work to get to this point

Douglas Burdett (40:29): In the ad world. I remember there was an expression of you can't rush a cake, which is just, you know, they wanted a great television campaign out of nothing without having done any of the work first. It's like, yeah, yeah. There's a little bit of a process there. So John, just a, a reminder tell folks where they can get access to all the resources and the,

John Jantsch (40:52): The course you bet. So I know listeners have heard me say this before. I'll say it again. The ultimate marketing engine.com is where you'll find out about the book. You'll see something there that says, get the companion course. Obviously just follow the instructions. When you get the book, you'll actually find a link to the resources page that will allow you to download really everything associated, kind of we've set it up chapter by chapter. So you can kind of know where that particular tool is as well. You can get a couple free chapters. The book comes out September 21st. If you're listening to this on the day that we launched it, you still got a couple of days to pre-order the book when this spot podcast comes out and grab that course and really get yourself a headstart before that book shows up. If you're listening to this after September 21st, then gosh, darn it. Go to your favorite bookseller and pick up a copy of the ultimate marketing engine. I I'm going to be very self-serving here, doc. I think that, well, this is your show. So I know every time I say this, I think, are they really buying this or not? But,

Douglas Burdett (41:57): But, well, I mean, the fact that I'm on here interviewing you about your book, because you didn't want to talk about it. So it's okay, John it's okay. It's just books

John Jantsch (42:05): Are the best bargain.

Douglas Burdett (42:07): I mean, there is no better ROI than buying a book. And you know, you're probably the same way. There have been a couple of books in my long career that had such an enormous impact, the right book at the right time. It truly is invaluable.

John Jantsch (42:23): I have a, a gentleman that has a, a business helping other authors and sales professionals and, and people that call themselves authorities, you know, building kind of courses and building, you know, their platform. And he had an advanced reader copy of this. I had him on my podcast and, and he swore that this book had given him an idea that was worth $250,000. So if you get, you know, if you get $50 out of this book, it's been, it's been a great bargain and now I've got to really do a number on you. I'm a little power tip here. There is a version of audible. And I find that this book is meaty. I mean, there's a lot of stuff that I'm asking you to do some new concepts. One of the things that I've found to be really impactful is when I really want to, to internalize a book is, is to get the P I'm still a paperback reader to get, get that or the Kindle version, but then also get the audible version. And I will actually listen at like one and a half times speed as I read. And I just find that first off, I get read the book a lot faster that way, but I also find that it really helps me with, with retaining the ideas or even understanding the ideas to hear the author say them, or whoever's reading the book while I'm actually seeing them on the page. So, you know, now you're in for another nine bucks I think, or something, but wow. And

Douglas Burdett (43:42): You actually did the

John Jantsch (43:43): Audio didn't I, I did do, I did do the audio. James Earl Jones was busy that day.

Douglas Burdett (43:49): I think. So. Let me make sure I understand this. I learned so much from you, John John chance. So you get the audio version and listen to it and read at the same.

John Jantsch (43:59): I do. And I actually crank it up to one and a half times. So interesting. A lot of authors really read slowly I find. And so I crank it up to one, one and a half and I read the, I actually see the pages. I'm not probably not reading the same way I would read, but I actually see the words as they're being said to me as well. And it just, I don't know, it just really makes it go deeper.

Douglas Burdett (44:22): I might have to try that. I have only listened to one audio book ever. I have to read the hard copy to absorb it for some reason. So, but that's an interesting idea. Well, that's great. The

John Jantsch (44:31): Other thing it does is it keeps me focused because sometimes when you're listening to an audio book, you know, you tend to multitask and then you're like, wait,

Douglas Burdett (44:38): What happened to chapter eight? That's why I had to take all the social media off my phone and put it on the table away from me. If I may be so bold to listen to the interview that I did with John Jantsch about the ultimate marketing engine, just visit his episodes website page at marketing book, podcast.com. If this wasn't enough for you, you know, go there. There's a lot of really stupid jokes that John tolerated. So you know, something different to listen to John, thank you very much for the opportunity to guest host on your show. The second time it's been a real honor, it's been an honor both times and congratulations on the ultimate marketing engine.

John Jantsch (45:17): Thanks so much, and I appreciate your work and appreciate the support. So thanks everybody for listening, tuning in and we'll catch you next time.

Speaker 3 (45:25): All right. So that wraps up another episode. I want to thank you so much for tuning in and you know, we love those reviews and comments. And just generally tell me what you think also did you know that you could offer the duct tape marketing system, our system to your clients and build a complete marketing consulting coaching business, or maybe level up an agency with some additional services. That's right. Check out the duct tape marketing consultant network. You can find it at duct tape, marketing.com and just scroll down a little and find that offer our system to your clients tab.

This episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network.

 

speaking

A Guide to Building a Sustainable Speaking Career

Marketing Podcast with Michael Port and Andrew Davis

andrew-davis-michael-portIn this episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast, I interview Michael Port and Andrew Davis. Andrew Davis is a best-selling author keynote speaker. He’s also worked with the Muppets. I’m also joined by Michael Port his co-author of a book called Referable Speaker: Your Guide to Building a Sustainable Speaking Career—No Fame Required.

Key Takeaway:

What’s the formula for building a sustainable career as a speaker? That’s the question Michael Port and Andrew Davis set out to answer in their book, The Referable SpeakerMost advice out there tells you to spend a ton of time building your personal brand to generate more speaking opportunities. Write a blog, record podcasts, post on Instagram, and upload to YouTube. You share your expertise and insight freely. All of that hard work might get you one gig. But if you’ve been in the industry long enough, you know that you don’t actually get speaking gigs, you earn them. And you earn them by being referable.

In this episode, Michael Port and Andrew Davis show you why you need to stop investing in marketing yourself as a great speaker and start investing in your speech. Because, unless you’re famous, event organizers won’t buy you (or your personal brand). They’ll buy your speech, then your idea, then you―in that order.

Questions I ask Michael Port and Andrew Davis:

  • [2:15] Would you say the book is really about being a better speaker, having a better speech, and being more referable?
  • [3:07] Can you explain the first idea in the book – the speech is the cake?
  • [4:59] Why do you only need one killer speech?
  • [6:37] Would you say that a hard part for a lot of speakers is that some hired gigs want them to customize their speeches?
  • [7:56] Would you say the measure of success of your speech is whether or not you’re getting referred for new speaking opportunities?
  • [10:47] Are you making the case that this book is for somebody that is a keynote speaker wanting to go to the next level or is this for somebody that’s just starting out?
  • [11:23] How do you find your first speaking gigs?
  • [14:13] How do you get to make that transition to speaking gigs where people are there to be entertained or inspired not learn a specific skill?
  • [19:37] Does there need to be theater or entertainment in your performance?
  • [24:26] How can people learn more about your work together, individually, your book, etc.?

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This episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network.

 

less-is-more-content-strategy

The Less Is Almost Always More Content Strategy

Marketing Podcast with Kate Cooper

kate-cooperIn this episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast, I interview Kate Cooper. Kate is the content strategist at Homeward, a new kind of home finance company. She is a plain language advocate who believes in a less-is-almost-always more approach to content. She started writing for a living in college and joined Homeward in 2020. In the space between, she was a magazine editor, a content consultant for a tech consultancy, and started her own content agency, Language Arts.

Key Takeaway:

You don’t need more content — you need better content. In this episode, Kate Cooper talks about her less is almost always more approach to content, how different components of copywriting and content creation can work together cohesively, and how to think about content as stages that align with the customer journey.

Questions I ask Kate Cooper:

  • [2:06] What’s your philosophy on the content that you put in your newsletter, your Friday Five?
  • [5:20] I hear a lot of content producers talk about the differences between content and copywriting. Do you have an opinion on the difference and how you describe those?
  • [7:16] How do content design, web design, and SEO work together in the world we live in today?
  • [9:46] I read a statistic recently that said 92% of people visit a website for the first time, for reasons other than making a purchase or even engaging with the businesses there. What does a statistic like that suggest to you that particularly about our homepage, the journey of our home page, or what the jobs of our homepage need to be now?
  • [13:01] So if you were advising somebody on the About us page and the Contact us page – what I would call very important, significant pages – what do those pages need to accomplish?
  • [17:32] How do you think about stages of the customer journey as it relates to content?
  • [20:25] Where can more people find out about your work?

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This episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network.

 

Delivering Happiness At Work And Beyond

Marketing Podcast with Jenn Lim

jenn-limIn this episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast, I interview Jen Limm. Jen is the CEO of Delivering Happiness, a company she and Tony Hsieh (the late CEO of Zappos.com) co-founded to create happier company cultures for a more profitable and sustainable approach to business. She’s also the author of Beyond Happiness: How Authentic Leaders Prioritize Purpose and People for Growth and Impact.

Key Takeaway:

The bottom line is — if you have more happy employees, you’ll have happier customers, and then you’ll actually have a more profitable, sustainable, and meaningful impact on the world.

In this episode, Jenn Lim, the co-founder and CEO of Delivering Happiness, talks about concepts from her new book — Beyond Happiness: How Authentic Leaders Prioritize Purpose and People for Growth and Impact. Jenn shares how to cultivate a culture that can adapt to change, be highly profitable, and support all its people…starting with yourself.

Questions I ask Jenn Lim:

  • [1:49] How do you actually go about doing the work of creating happier company cultures?
  • [4:10] Has the organization’s mission that stemmed from the book Delivering Happiness changed over the last ten years?
  • [5:41] Can you unpack the word ‘purpose’ and how the very idea of identifying your purpose can be very daunting for people nowadays?
  • [9:14] Do you have any tips that can help people better understand their purpose without it being such an overwhelming task?
  • [11:27] Helping people find a personal purpose is really so that they can connect with the company’s mission. Do those two things run counter sometimes?
  • [13:04] In the book, there is a workbook people can download and write their answers on. Can you talk more about it in more detail?
  • [16:40] I’m sure you’ve done some research about the ROI of happiness specifically with organizations. Can you share any data you have about companies who have embraced this idea of bringing happiness into the workplace and what value it brings?
  • [19:47] Where can people find out more about your book and the work you’re doing at Delivering Happiness?

More About Jenn Lim:

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This episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network.

 

keys-to-success

Why Playing The Long Game Is Essential To Success

Marketing Podcast with Dorie Clark

dorie-clarkIn this episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast, I interview Dorie Clark. Dorie is a Duke & Columbia University Business Professor, ranked one of the top 50 business thinkers in the world by Thinkers 50. She’s also the author of Reinventing You and Stand Out.

Key Takeaway:

We as humans too often push ourselves past our limit. We constantly feel rushed, overwhelmed, and perennially behind. Because of this, we keep our heads down, focused on the next thing, and the next, without a moment to breathe.

In this episode, Dorie Clark talks about concepts from her new book, The Long Game, where she dives into how to break out of this endless cycle and create the kind of interesting, meaningful lives we all seek. It’s about doing small things over time to achieve our goals—and being willing to keep at them, even when they seem pointless, boring, or hard. By doing this, we can tap into the power of small changes that, made today, will have an enormous and disproportionate impact on our future success.

Questions I ask Dorie Clark:

  • [1:29] Do you think the world needs another get rich quick book?
  • [1:50] Doesn’t the world just want quick fixes?
  • [4:30] Is this meant to be a more personal book or is this how to build a business book?
  • [5:39] Why is saying no so hard for people?
  • [12:43] Saying no, giving yourself time to think is about setting boundaries – so how do you start establishing those boundaries?
  • [15:25] What’s your approach to being able to identify what those ‘right’ goals are?
  • [18:10] Can you unpack this idea of strategic leverage from your book?
  • [21:02]  How we can use independence, curiosity, and resilience to achieve entrepreneurial success?
  • [23:13] What’s the best way for people to learn more about you and your work?

More About Dorie Clark:

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This episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network.

 

building

Building A Referral Success System

Marketing Podcast with John Jantsch

john-jantschIn this episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast, I’m doing a solo show. I’m talking about a topic from my upcoming book, The Ultimate Marketing Engine: Five Steps to Ridiculously Consistent Growth. The fifth step in the book is all about referral generation — and that’s what I’m talking about today.

Key Takeaway:

In this episode, I’m talking about one of my favorite topics: referral generation. I have an approach that I believe that those who embrace it will find that generating referrals will become one of their primary activities for their business.

Topics I Cover:

  • [1:51] The concept of teaching your strategic partners and customers how to generate more referrals
  • [2:29] Building a referral success system
  • [3:03] Why and how this idea works
  • [6:28] How a referral club or mastermind could become a great potent referral generator
  • [7:15] Insight on how to structure and run it
  • [8:03] Coming up with your offer or ways of compensation for referred business

Resources From This Episode:

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This episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network.

 

worthy

Cultivating A Sense Of Self-Worth

Marketing Podcast with Tim Washer

tim-washer-comedianIn this episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast, I interview Tim Washer. Tim spent 20 years at IBM, Cisco, and Accenture, mostly feigning interest on conference calls. Moonlighting as a comedy writer/actor on SNL, Conan and The Late Show equipped him to use humor to humanize some of the world’s most boring brands. He uses laughter to help corporations capture attention, show empathy, build rapport and make a persuasive case with B2B technology audiences on topics such as the Internet of Things and mainframe computers, where the comedy writes itself.

Key Takeaway:

Feeling unworthy is a common emotion many humans have — at any and all ages. In this episode, Tim Washer reminds us of our humanness as he talks about his struggle with feelings of unworthiness throughout his career as a comedian. He highlights his lessons learned and how getting comfortable with being uncomfortable has pushed him to become a better version of himself.

Questions I ask Tim Washer:

  • [1:37] What are your feelings about the state of the shows like SNL and Conan?
  • [3:51] When you first started as a keynote speaker, did you bring a tip jar and put it up in the front?
  • [5:14] Professional speakers were dramatically impacted over the last year — what did last year teach you?
  • [8:43] You’re transitioning a bit with your speaking and I know you’re delving into talking about change and culture — can you share what you’re working on right now?
  • [11:05] How have you also made physical changes in your life?
  • [13:15] Physical wellness now has seemingly become an important part of your routine in your life — where does embracing physical wellness fit in your mental health?
  • [15:15] If I were going to go hear Tim Washer speak on the stage today, what would the topic be?

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This episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network.

 

coming-alive

Finding The Work That Makes You Come Alive

Marketing Podcast with Jonathan Fields

In this episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast, I interview Jonathan Fields. Jonathan is an award-winning author, executive producer, and host of one of the top-ranked podcasts in the world, Good Life Project®. He’s also the author of a new book – Sparked: Discover Your Unique Imprint for Work that Makes You Come Alive.

Key Takeaway:

We’re all born with a certain “imprint” for work that makes us come alive. Drawing upon years of research, experimentation, more than 25-million data points generated by over half a million people, hundreds of deep-dive conversations — Jonathan Fields and his team at Spark Endeavors, developed the Sparketype imprints and methodology that helps you uncover the work that motivates you and fills you with purpose.

In this episode, I talk with Jonathan about his new book SPARKED and how your Sparketype can help you discover, with far more depth, what sparks you, what drains you, where you stumble and come alive, so you can reclaim a sense of direction, control, and purpose.

Questions I ask:

  • [2:07]  In your new book Sparked, your contention is that we’re all born with a certain imprint for work that makes us come alive — are some people that also are worried that they’ll miss uncovering what it is?
  • [4:52] Can you talk about the research that you did to come to your conclusions?
  • [7:10] Can you walk me through the assessment and what went into the development of the assessment that you created?
  • [10:34] How would you say this assessment differs from a StrengthsFinder kind of assessment?
  • [11:52] You’ve looked at lots of results — have you started to be able to predict what someone’s results might be?
  • [14:20] Can we unpack my results from taking the assessment myself?
  • [18:41] Where can people take their own assessment?
  • [19:33] I know my Sparketypes now — now what do I do with that information?

More About Jonathan Fields:

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This episode of the Duct Tape Marketing Podcast is brought to you by the HubSpot Podcast Network.